From: Smylers Date: 22:41 on 15 Aug 2007 Subject: Evince Blocking Sound Evince is a PDF viewer. Obviously no application should ever be hogging the sound device such that other apps can't play music -- but at least a sound-playing app has a plausible reason for why it's doing _anything_ with the soundcard. Whereas Evince was only charged with displaying a document, something which it was doing reasonably well. It hadn't made any noise. It has no excuse for being the answer to the question 'what do I have to kill off to make sound work again?'. That it was is hateful. Smylers
From: David Cantrell Date: 23:43 on 15 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound On Wed, Aug 15, 2007 at 10:41:59PM +0100, Smylers wrote: > Evince is a PDF viewer... > It has > no excuse for being the answer to the question 'what do I have to kill > off to make sound work again?'. That it was is hateful. Close, but no cigar. What really is spectacularly hateful is that the latest and greatest (and most expensive, of course) version of Acrobat can infest documents with sounds and even video.
From: Chris Devers Date: 03:22 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound On Aug 15, 2007, at 6:43 PM, David Cantrell wrote: > Close, but no cigar. What really is spectacularly hateful is that the > latest and greatest (and most expensive, of course) version of Acrobat > can infest documents with sounds and even video. Surely this is the natural outcome of trying to blend PDF, which one would suppose is naturally a medium for the digital equivalent of static printed content, with Flash, which one would suppose is naturally a medium for dynamic content, on grounds that they now belong to the same company, and that company wants to have one plugin on all the world's web browsers. It comes soo..... close... to making sense. Almost.
From: Martin Ebourne Date: 08:10 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound On Wed, 2007-08-15 at 22:22 -0400, Chris Devers wrote: > On Aug 15, 2007, at 6:43 PM, David Cantrell wrote: > > > Close, but no cigar. What really is spectacularly hateful is that the > > latest and greatest (and most expensive, of course) version of Acrobat > > can infest documents with sounds and even video. > > Surely this is the natural outcome of trying to blend PDF, which one > would suppose is naturally a medium for the digital equivalent of > static printed content, with Flash, which one would suppose is > naturally a medium for dynamic content, on grounds that they now > belong to the same company, and that company wants to have one plugin > on all the world's web browsers. > > It comes soo..... close... to making sense. > > Almost. PHB: But static content is just dynamic content that isn't moving! ENG: Uh-oh we lose. Cheers, Martin.
From: Sean Conner Date: 08:38 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound It was thus said that the Great Chris Devers once stated: > On Aug 15, 2007, at 6:43 PM, David Cantrell wrote: > > >Close, but no cigar. What really is spectacularly hateful is that the > >latest and greatest (and most expensive, of course) version of Acrobat > >can infest documents with sounds and even video. > > Surely this is the natural outcome of trying to blend PDF, which one > would suppose is naturally a medium for the digital equivalent of > static printed content, with Flash, which one would suppose is > naturally a medium for dynamic content, on grounds that they now > belong to the same company, and that company wants to have one plugin > on all the world's web browsers. Of all the sound using apps I have, Flash is the only one that *doesn't* let me adjust the sound level *for that app*. Quicktime? I can lower the volume from within Quicktime and not have to adjust the master volume control. The DVD player? iTunes? Yup. Even RealMedia and WindowsMedia players? Yup. Flash? Nope. Gotta blare at whatever master volume I have set. -spc (Heck, I'd be happy if I could mute Flash ... )
From: jrodman Date: 01:09 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound On Wed, Aug 15, 2007 at 10:41:59PM +0100, Smylers wrote: > Evince is a PDF viewer. Obviously no application should ever be hogging > the sound device such that other apps can't play music -- but at least a > sound-playing app has a plausible reason for why it's doing _anything_ > with the soundcard. > > Whereas Evince was only charged with displaying a document, something > which it was doing reasonably well. It hadn't made any noise. It has > no excuse for being the answer to the question 'what do I have to kill > off to make sound work again?'. That it was is hateful. I see your hate and raise you: Who the hell designed a sound API where any program that is making sounds exclusively locks access to the sound emitting hardware? WHAT! THE! HELL! -josh
From: Jonathan Stowe Date: 08:56 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound On Wed, 2007-08-15 at 22:41 +0100, Smylers wrote: > Evince is a PDF viewer. Obviously no application should ever be hogging > the sound device such that other apps can't play music -- but at least a > sound-playing app has a plausible reason for why it's doing _anything_ > with the soundcard. > > Whereas Evince was only charged with displaying a document, something > which it was doing reasonably well. It hadn't made any noise. It has > no excuse for being the answer to the question 'what do I have to kill > off to make sound work again?'. That it was is hateful. On a previous laptop, unloading the ALSA drivers would cause firefox to crash, it appears that for some reason it was linked with the ALSA library EVEN THOUGH IT COULD NOT AND IS NOT DESIGNED TO MAKE SOUND BY ITSELF. This may be a software-packager rather than direct software hate though. /J\
From: Sean Conner Date: 09:18 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound It was thus said that the Great Jonathan Stowe once stated: > > On a previous laptop, unloading the ALSA drivers would cause firefox to > crash, it appears that for some reason it was linked with the ALSA > library EVEN THOUGH IT COULD NOT AND IS NOT DESIGNED TO MAKE SOUND BY > ITSELF. Ah, did Firefox just freeze, or did it crash, causing the window to disappear? On my Linux system, Firefox will sometimes freeze if I try to play a Flash-based video, and at first, I thought it just crashed and would have to grovel through the process list and kill -9 the dozen or so Firefox processes, but soon came to realize it was just waiting for some lock or something and would eventually play. > This may be a software-packager rather than direct software hate though. I don't know ... isn't that still a software-hate? -spc (Or maybe it's just a Linux hate?)
From: Jonathan Stowe Date: 09:56 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound On Thu, 2007-08-16 at 04:18 -0400, Sean Conner wrote: > It was thus said that the Great Jonathan Stowe once stated: > > > > On a previous laptop, unloading the ALSA drivers would cause firefox to > > crash, it appears that for some reason it was linked with the ALSA > > library EVEN THOUGH IT COULD NOT AND IS NOT DESIGNED TO MAKE SOUND BY > > ITSELF. > > Ah, did Firefox just freeze, or did it crash, causing the window to > disappear? No, real crashy window go away stuff. > On my Linux system, Firefox will sometimes freeze if I try to > play a Flash-based video, and at first, I thought it just crashed and would > have to grovel through the process list and kill -9 the dozen or so Firefox > processes, but soon came to realize it was just waiting for some lock or > something and would eventually play. Oh yes Flash based media players are another source of hate. Yesterday I opened an "audacity" (open source multitrack audio editor) project and it claimed that it couldn't open the playback device, checking the configuration LO AND BEHOLD there were no audio devices available in the drop down. To cut a long tale involving strace and fuser short it appeared that the flash player (or the 32->64bit shim thing that is necessary because no twat feels it necessary to provide a 64bit flash plugin) had gone titsup locking the audio device somehow AND HADN'T GONE AWAY WHEN I CLOSED FIREFOX. WHY DO I USE THIS GODDAM HIPPY OPERATING SYSTEM! /J\
From: Matt McLeod Date: 10:07 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound Jonathan Stowe wrote: > Oh yes Flash based media players are another source of hate. Yesterday > I opened an "audacity" (open source multitrack audio editor) project and > it claimed that it couldn't open the playback device, checking the > configuration LO AND BEHOLD there were no audio devices available in the > drop down. To cut a long tale involving strace and fuser short it > appeared that the flash player (or the 32->64bit shim thing that is > necessary because no twat feels it necessary to provide a 64bit flash > plugin) had gone titsup locking the audio device somehow AND HADN'T GONE > AWAY WHEN I CLOSED FIREFOX. WHY DO I USE THIS GODDAM HIPPY OPERATING > SYSTEM! Audio is the biggest source of hate in Linux as a desktop OS, at least IMAO. There are other problems but the pile of different and conflicting ways of talking to audio devices seriously buggers up what is otherwise becoming a vaguely-usable platform. Matt (and this from someone who has hated Linux desktops for years.)
From: Peter da Silva Date: 11:35 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound > plugin) had gone titsup locking the audio device somehow AND HADN'T > GONE > AWAY WHEN I CLOSED FIREFOX. WHY DO I USE THIS GODDAM HIPPY OPERATING > SYSTEM! Why do you use that goddamn corporate sellout plugin if you're not gonna use a goddamn corporate sellout OS? Flash is made of hate.
From: Robert Rothenberg Date: 13:57 on 16 Aug 2007 Subject: Re: Evince Blocking Sound ------=_Part_54462_30287021.1187269033002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Interesting. I'm not able to reproduce such hate on my system, gladly. Is this a specific document, or just whenever Evince runs? It may be that some fancy-pants PDF file has some embedded multimedia. On 15/08/07, Smylers <Smylers@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Evince is a PDF viewer. Obviously no application should ever be hogging > the sound device such that other apps can't play music -- but at least a > sound-playing app has a plausible reason for why it's doing _anything_ > with the soundcard. > > Whereas Evince was only charged with displaying a document, something > which it was doing reasonably well. It hadn't made any noise. It has > no excuse for being the answer to the question 'what do I have to kill > off to make sound work again?'. That it was is hateful. > > Smylers > > ------=_Part_54462_30287021.1187269033002 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Interesting. I'm not able to reproduce such hate on my system, gladly. <br><br>Is this a specific document, or just whenever Evince runs? It may be that some fancy-pants PDF file has some embedded multimedia. <br><br> <br><br><div><span class="gmail_quote">On 15/08/07, <b class="gmail_sendername">Smylers</b> <<a href="mailto:Smylers@xxxxxxx.xxx">Smylers@xxxxxxx.xxx</a>> wrote:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> Evince is a PDF viewer. Obviously no application should ever be hogging<br>the sound device such that other apps can't play music -- but at least a<br>sound-playing app has a plausible reason for why it's doing _anything_ <br>with the soundcard.<br><br>Whereas Evince was only charged with displaying a document, something<br>which it was doing reasonably well. It hadn't made any noise. It has<br>no excuse for being the answer to the question 'what do I have to kill <br>off to make sound work again?'. That it was is hateful.<br><br>Smylers<br><br></blockquote></div><br> ------=_Part_54462_30287021.1187269033002--
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